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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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from Australia for science and reason

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[Music]

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hello again from the sceptic zone

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podcast richardsaunders here with you

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from Sydney Australia it's episode

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number 518 for the 23rd of September

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2018 coming up on this week's show we'll

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a bit later on I'm going to be talking

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about the history of the skeptic zone

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since it's almost 10 years now it's over

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500 episodes but it's not quite 10 years

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on the 26th of September this year it'll

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be 10 years since the first episode of

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the skeptic zone went out are we talking

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about the history of the skeptic zone

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and I just know just looking through the

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archives today that the first episode of

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the skeptic tank podcast the show which

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preceded this I put out on the 15th of

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September 2005 and that lasted 5 6 7 8 9

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and 10 12 episodes or something like

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that but more about that coming up later

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on in the show but before all that we're

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going to kick off with the report from

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the raw skeptic the raw skeptic report

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with Heidi Robertson she's going to be

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telling us about a recent council

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meeting in the Byron Shire where the

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motion was put up that council

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facilities should not be rented out to

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the anti-vaccination crowd and Heidi

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spoke in favor of the proposition that

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the council facilities should not be

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rented out to these people how did it go

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was she successful what did she say

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coming up in a moment on the raw skeptic

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report also we talked about the recent

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destruction of Sydney hmm yes well a

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couple of days ago a giant tidal wave is

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there any other kind a tidal wave was

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supposed to devastate Sydney costing

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400,000 lives taking 400,000 lives

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wiping out suburbs destroying the

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Harbour Bridge and the airport and so on

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this was a prophecy being put around

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scaring people over recent months well

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of course the the 20th of September came

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and went with only the normal activity

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off the coast we're going to be talking

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about this prophecy and some of the real

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dangers when people go around raving

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about the end of the world then it's

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skeptics in the pub may not heads for

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Sydney skeptics in the pub and he chats

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to Nathan sentence who is a First

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Nations man who works at the Australian

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Museum here in Sydney in First Nations

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history and first nations archiving and

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things like that he gave a very

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interesting talk at skeptics in the pub

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a couple of weeks ago and he's going to

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be chatting to Maine out about some of

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the issues he confronts when cataloging

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and archiving and doing research into

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First Nations history here in Australia

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and very it was a very interesting talk

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I must say the whole audience was

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captivated by what Nathan had to say and

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it was a very worthwhile talk indeed

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anyway a bit about that with Maine odds

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spooky action now I must send out a huge

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congratulations to my dear friends

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Celestia Ward from squaring the strange

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podcast who had a baby just a few days

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ago and I saw the photograph of mum and

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Bubba as they say and it just warms the

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heart congratulations Celestia when that

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reminds me I'm going to be on squaring

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the strange in a few weeks we did a

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pretty record because of the impending

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birth I think they've been archiving

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some episodes saving them up and I had a

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wonderful hour chatting to Ben Radford

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and Celestia Ward about the

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million-dollar challenge and that will

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be coming up on the squaring the strange

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podcast in the near future one to look

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out for well that's enough for me at the

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moment I gotta run downstairs make

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myself up some instant miso soup very

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nice slip that down come back and bring

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you the rest of the skeptic zone

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[Music]

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it's the raw skeptic report with Heidi

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Robertson and joining me now all the way

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from the beautiful north coast of New

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South Wales it's the raw skeptic herself

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Heidi Robertson hello Heidi hello well

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nice to chat with you we rarely do this

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we don't do it often enough I know

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what's with that we'll have to we'll

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have to do some more interviews Skype

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each other more we will but lucky me I

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get to see you in only a matter of a few

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very short weeks you're coming down to

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join us at skeptic on that's right I'm

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so excited about it oh we are - Heidi

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are you're always a welcome visitor here

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in Sydney and who knows we might even

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get you into the media room for a couple

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of interviews oh yeah I'm always up for

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that I know may not all be champing at

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the bit to interview everybody he

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possibly can anyway yeah I love Maynard

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absolutely well let's talk about some

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more serious things the reason we're

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having the raw skeptic segment this week

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is the continuing story of your area of

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New South Wales the far north coastal

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region and the the continuing saga as we

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say with the anti-vaxxers in the the

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probe axes and we know which camp we're

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in but I understand as we're recording

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only today there was a big meeting at

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the the local council yes there was

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Byron Shire Council so there are nine

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councillors including the mayor of Byron

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Shire Council and one of one of the

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counselors councillor Paul Spooner put a

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motion forward to which basically said

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that council should no longer allow

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anti-vaccination groups specifically the

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Australian vaccination risks Network

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they've changed their name

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two risks then one now specifically them

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to stop them from hiring out council

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facilities in the future because over

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the past at least couple of years

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council has hired out but well mainly

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the Mullen bimba Civic Hall for events

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that the AVN has hosted but also a

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couple of other venues that they run as

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well so council a Spooner put forward

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the motion that council should stop

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leasing for venues out and I was there

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to speak in favor of that motion right

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and that was just this morning

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so in fact Heidi I understand that

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you've recorded what what you said not

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at the meeting but you you've basically

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made a recording of the words that you

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said yes just this afternoon in the car

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while I was waiting for my son to finish

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soccer training I grabbed the

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opportunity

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I grabbed my the notes from my talk and

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I recorded for you what I said earlier

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this morning in the meeting and here it

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is

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Robertson and I'm here as a

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representative of the Northern Rivers

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vaccination supporters group we are

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endorsed by the World Health

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Organization as a reliable source of

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vaccine information babies too young to

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be vaccinated the elderly the immune

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compromised like chronically ill people

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and cancer patients all rely on

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community immunity to protect them and

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we have none here as Mullen bimby has

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the lowest vaccination rates in

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Australia anti-vaccination groups such

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as the Australian vaccination risks

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network or the AVN often deny their anti

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vaccination stance instead calling

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themselves pro-choice the ovn has shown

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time and time again that despite calling

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themselves pro-choice there really is no

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ambiguity about their stance on

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vaccinations they have equated

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vaccinations to rape

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they have stages that vaccines are

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linked to everything from cancer to

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autoimmune disorders and even came up

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with the horrendous term shaken

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maybe syndrome to imply that traumatic

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brain injury from child abusers is

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actually caused by vaccines pro-choice

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is desirable if you are actually basing

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that choice on good reliable information

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and not putting others at risk but

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please also consider the people in our

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community who had no choice please

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remember Dana and Kahless who were too

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young to be vaccinated for whooping

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cough and died and the six other babies

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airlifted out of our region with

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whooping cough during that same outbreak

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denying these groups and individuals the

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hiring of council venues is not an issue

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of free speech anti vaccination

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activists have multiple platforms to

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share their views online and they are

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free to hire any venue they please

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we are just opposing them using council

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venues secondly Australian law does not

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provide for a comprehensive right of

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free speech and even if it did free

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speech has its limits when the community

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is placed at risk the ovn has an

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official New South Wales Government

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public health warning against it and its

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president council is thereby

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facilitating the operations of the AVN

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in being a threat to the community by

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spreading misinformation and falsehood

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in a council area that already has the

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lowest rate of child immunization and

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the highest rate of vaccine preventable

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infectious disease our region last year

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had 9 times the rate of whooping cough

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as our neighbouring health district

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there are two sections of the Local

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Government Act that suggests that

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council may be in breach of its

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obligations in providing their venues to

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these groups specifically section 8 a 1

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e quote council should work

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cooperatively with other councils and

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the state government to achieve desired

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outcomes for the local community and

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quote

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and to counsel is providing services and

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facilities which are not appropriate to

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the current and future needs within its

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local community and of the wider public

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as required by section 24 in providing

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venues for these dangerous views council

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undermines government efforts to

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increase vaccination rates councils have

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the responsibility to maintain the state

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and federal government's commitment to

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public health last year an unamused

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little girl was airlifted from this

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region in a critical condition with

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tetanus the next day international anti

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vaccination campaigner David wolf was

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permitted to hire the Mullumbimby civic

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hall

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we recently had another avian event at

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the Civic Hall literally at the same

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time a community member was suffering in

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hospital from diphtheria we have the

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Mullen bin B council hall hired to

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anti-vaccination activist Stephanie

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messenger who wrote Melanie's marvelous

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measles measles was not so marvelous for

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Cecily's daughter Lane and Cecily is

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here today Lane died from complications

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of measles being too young to be

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vaccinated

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we had the Civic Hall booked by the AVN

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for a screening of another anti

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vaccination documentary last year each

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time council received calls to cancel

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these bookings each time council

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declined a disclaimer on the door is

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insufficient ethically and potentially

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legally can any group that promotes

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views that endanger the community hire

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council venues what are the limits and

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how does council carry out its due

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diligence in who hires its venues yes

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ouch ire is known for its diversity

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tolerance and inclusion of many

277
00:12:56,079 --> 00:12:53,420
different groups however we should never

278
00:12:58,240 --> 00:12:56,089
compromise ourselves and the vulnerable

279
00:13:01,389 --> 00:12:58,250
in our community by tacitly endorsing

280
00:13:05,740 --> 00:13:01,399
groups and individuals that have the

281
00:13:06,940 --> 00:13:05,750
potential to do real harm thank you well

282
00:13:08,829 --> 00:13:06,950
thanks for that heidi that's very

283
00:13:12,020 --> 00:13:08,839
powerful stuff what who else was

284
00:13:16,250 --> 00:13:12,030
speaking there yes I what

285
00:13:18,350 --> 00:13:16,260
happened after my so we each got five

286
00:13:20,450 --> 00:13:18,360
minutes to talk I spoke for five minutes

287
00:13:22,700 --> 00:13:20,460
and then the other local gentleman

288
00:13:26,030 --> 00:13:22,710
speaking against spoke for five minutes

289
00:13:28,910 --> 00:13:26,040
then the council moved on to all the

290
00:13:31,970 --> 00:13:28,920
other matters so we sat through probably

291
00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:31,980
an hour of all these other I can't even

292
00:13:36,680 --> 00:13:34,770
tell you my goodness there was people

293
00:13:38,090 --> 00:13:36,690
speaking about a local mobile phone

294
00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:38,100
tower they were up in arms about that

295
00:13:46,340 --> 00:13:44,840
so then we I was wondering when on earth

296
00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:46,350
they were going to vote for everything I

297
00:13:52,340 --> 00:13:47,730
just assumed it was going to be at the

298
00:13:58,420 --> 00:13:52,350
end of every motion but they had a short

299
00:14:00,950 --> 00:13:58,430
break and then our motion was voted on

300
00:14:03,770 --> 00:14:00,960
after that short break so what happened

301
00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:03,780
was council a Spooner first made a

302
00:14:09,590 --> 00:14:06,090
little speech about why he was bringing

303
00:14:12,980 --> 00:14:09,600
the motion to the table and you know

304
00:14:15,170 --> 00:14:12,990
basically said that he was disappointed

305
00:14:17,650 --> 00:14:15,180
that council had hired out these venues

306
00:14:19,940 --> 00:14:17,660
to these groups in the past and that

307
00:14:23,780 --> 00:14:19,950
they have responsibility to the

308
00:14:26,060 --> 00:14:23,790
community and and so on to and to not to

309
00:14:30,530 --> 00:14:26,070
not allow these groups to spread their

310
00:14:33,110 --> 00:14:30,540
misinformation in council facilities we

311
00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:33,120
didn't like the audience members didn't

312
00:14:38,450 --> 00:14:35,970
get a chance to talk at this point that

313
00:14:42,050 --> 00:14:38,460
this was all then a debate amongst the

314
00:14:46,490 --> 00:14:42,060
councilors themselves so the mayor Simon

315
00:14:50,210 --> 00:14:46,500
Richardson had quite a bit to say he

316
00:14:53,770 --> 00:14:50,220
spoke against the motion and his main

317
00:14:56,360 --> 00:14:53,780
points again were free speech and he

318
00:14:59,240 --> 00:14:56,370
brought up the fact that you know the

319
00:15:01,690 --> 00:14:59,250
Byron Shire how much it is is known for

320
00:15:04,220 --> 00:15:01,700
its diversity and tolerance and and

321
00:15:06,710 --> 00:15:04,230
we're known for having conversations

322
00:15:10,990 --> 00:15:06,720
that are difficult and that council

323
00:15:14,260 --> 00:15:11,000
should be happy to to facilitate those

324
00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:14,270
difficult discussions in their

325
00:15:22,820 --> 00:15:19,530
facilities so that was really it wasn't

326
00:15:25,639 --> 00:15:22,830
it wasn't I wasn't really surprised

327
00:15:30,230 --> 00:15:25,649
because I had heard kind of the same

328
00:15:32,239 --> 00:15:30,240
being from the man previously but it was

329
00:15:34,519 --> 00:15:32,249
nonetheless it was pretty pretty

330
00:15:38,749 --> 00:15:34,529
disappointing that there is the mayor of

331
00:15:41,420 --> 00:15:38,759
the Shire you know that this is the

332
00:15:47,929 --> 00:15:41,430
mayor of our local government is willing

333
00:15:49,879 --> 00:15:47,939
to keep leasing these facilities to to

334
00:15:53,869 --> 00:15:49,889
these to these groups and and local

335
00:15:56,169 --> 00:15:53,879
council is supposed to you know support

336
00:15:58,819 --> 00:15:56,179
what the state and federal governments

337
00:16:02,210 --> 00:15:58,829
public health initiatives are and in

338
00:16:04,699 --> 00:16:02,220
this case they're clearly clearly not

339
00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:04,709
but yes so that was very disappointing

340
00:16:09,319 --> 00:16:07,290
and it's interesting too just reading

341
00:16:10,939 --> 00:16:09,329
your notes which you were supplying a

342
00:16:12,439 --> 00:16:10,949
little bit earlier because obviously I

343
00:16:15,139 --> 00:16:12,449
wasn't at the meeting it's hundreds of

344
00:16:17,869 --> 00:16:15,149
kilometers away one argument that was

345
00:16:20,269 --> 00:16:17,879
put up which I quite I found quite

346
00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:20,279
interesting was this cherry-picking that

347
00:16:23,900 --> 00:16:22,170
they were saying that people in that

348
00:16:25,160 --> 00:16:23,910
area are happy to accept the science

349
00:16:27,530 --> 00:16:25,170
when it comes to something like climate

350
00:16:28,910 --> 00:16:27,540
change but the same science which says

351
00:16:30,829 --> 00:16:28,920
that vaccinations are safe and effective

352
00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:30,839
they reject so that was quite

353
00:16:34,340 --> 00:16:32,970
interesting yeah that's right that's

354
00:16:36,559 --> 00:16:34,350
something that councillor Spooner

355
00:16:39,139 --> 00:16:36,569
brought up actually to the gentleman

356
00:16:43,429 --> 00:16:39,149
that was speaking against the motion he

357
00:16:45,379 --> 00:16:43,439
said look why is it that you accept you

358
00:16:48,319 --> 00:16:45,389
know the the science of climate change

359
00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:48,329
but you don't accept the science of

360
00:16:52,730 --> 00:16:50,730
vaccination should we still be debating

361
00:16:55,819 --> 00:16:52,740
climate change and the fellow actually

362
00:16:58,639 --> 00:16:55,829
said yes we should we should be debating

363
00:17:01,759 --> 00:16:58,649
everything all the time or you know

364
00:17:06,789 --> 00:17:01,769
constantly he and he is well known for

365
00:17:11,419 --> 00:17:08,990
yeah but it was it was interesting

366
00:17:14,779 --> 00:17:11,429
because it's so true people in this area

367
00:17:18,829 --> 00:17:14,789
are all on board with climate change and

368
00:17:21,769 --> 00:17:18,839
environmental you know minimizing their

369
00:17:24,500 --> 00:17:21,779
carbon footprint and so on but when it

370
00:17:26,990 --> 00:17:24,510
comes to vaccinations no they don't and

371
00:17:29,419 --> 00:17:27,000
one of the other counselors she she

372
00:17:31,730 --> 00:17:29,429
started talking about you know what are

373
00:17:34,399 --> 00:17:31,740
the motivations of big pharma and why

374
00:17:38,539 --> 00:17:34,409
should we blindly accept what we're told

375
00:17:39,540 --> 00:17:38,549
and it was it was really it was really

376
00:17:42,120 --> 00:17:39,550
desired

377
00:17:42,930 --> 00:17:42,130
hearing that kind of theme yeah well

378
00:17:45,360 --> 00:17:42,940
that's straight out of the

379
00:17:48,510 --> 00:17:45,370
anti-vaccination playbook isn't it all

380
00:17:53,460 --> 00:17:48,520
those sort of arguments it really really

381
00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:53,470
was and you know the the old she also

382
00:17:57,660 --> 00:17:55,570
brought up that well these groups aren't

383
00:17:58,980 --> 00:17:57,670
telling people to not vaccinate you know

384
00:18:02,310 --> 00:17:58,990
we should all be doing our own research

385
00:18:04,350 --> 00:18:02,320
and it was exactly you know the things

386
00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:04,360
that you read all the time on the

387
00:18:09,900 --> 00:18:06,970
internet from the the vaccin

388
00:18:13,070 --> 00:18:09,910
anti-vaccination crowd they do say I'm

389
00:18:15,870 --> 00:18:13,080
not anti vaccination I'm pro-choice but

390
00:18:17,550 --> 00:18:15,880
if you know there's no like I said in my

391
00:18:20,310 --> 00:18:17,560
talk there's no ambiguity about where

392
00:18:24,180 --> 00:18:20,320
these groups stand equating vaccination

393
00:18:25,700 --> 00:18:24,190
to rape and and saying that shaken baby

394
00:18:28,980 --> 00:18:25,710
syndrome is actually caused by

395
00:18:30,750 --> 00:18:28,990
vaccinations and not child abuse you

396
00:18:33,980 --> 00:18:30,760
can't really read that any other way

397
00:18:36,540 --> 00:18:33,990
than that if they are anti vaccination

398
00:18:39,300 --> 00:18:36,550
yes yeah I mean they can try to fool

399
00:18:41,940 --> 00:18:39,310
other people but they shouldn't even

400
00:18:45,270 --> 00:18:41,950
even pretend to try and fool people like

401
00:18:47,430 --> 00:18:45,280
you and I and people on the side of

402
00:18:48,690 --> 00:18:47,440
science and reason we know we know what

403
00:18:51,120 --> 00:18:48,700
they're doing we know their tricks and

404
00:18:54,150 --> 00:18:51,130
we know their game well a lost today

405
00:18:55,830 --> 00:18:54,160
Heidi but the battle goes on and the

406
00:18:57,450 --> 00:18:55,840
important thing the very important thing

407
00:19:00,090 --> 00:18:57,460
is you were there you were there

408
00:19:03,360 --> 00:19:00,100
sticking up for science and reason and

409
00:19:07,650 --> 00:19:03,370
common sense and you know all all credit

410
00:19:10,290 --> 00:19:07,660
to you yeah well you know I mean I had I

411
00:19:12,300 --> 00:19:10,300
had two other members of our group there

412
00:19:15,810 --> 00:19:12,310
with me today for some moral support and

413
00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:15,820
one of those members Cecily lost her

414
00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:18,250
daughter she's a local to this region as

415
00:19:23,730 --> 00:19:20,650
well she lost her daughter Lane to SS PA

416
00:19:26,190 --> 00:19:23,740
which listeners might know of as a it's

417
00:19:28,890 --> 00:19:26,200
a fatal neurodegenerative disorder that

418
00:19:30,690 --> 00:19:28,900
is a result of a measles infection and

419
00:19:32,970 --> 00:19:30,700
Lane was 10 months old when she

420
00:19:35,970 --> 00:19:32,980
contracted measles in this region she

421
00:19:38,910 --> 00:19:35,980
was she was literally six to eight weeks

422
00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:38,920
off having her first measles vaccination

423
00:19:42,780 --> 00:19:40,690
at 12 months of age which is when they

424
00:19:46,110 --> 00:19:42,790
get it on the schedule she contracted

425
00:19:49,260 --> 00:19:46,120
measles and seemingly got over it but

426
00:19:52,740 --> 00:19:49,270
then about seven years later contracted

427
00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:52,750
this SS PA and it was absolutely

428
00:19:57,120 --> 00:19:54,970
devastating for poor Cecily all these

429
00:20:00,000 --> 00:19:57,130
years later she came to this meeting to

430
00:20:01,230 --> 00:20:00,010
support me and for her to sit there with

431
00:20:04,770 --> 00:20:01,240
this anti-vaccination

432
00:20:08,580 --> 00:20:04,780
crowd behind us sort of jeering and you

433
00:20:10,740 --> 00:20:08,590
know disturbing the meeting and and and

434
00:20:13,140 --> 00:20:10,750
mocking as as they always do in these

435
00:20:16,380 --> 00:20:13,150
things yes I don't know how she kept her

436
00:20:19,830 --> 00:20:16,390
composure but she did so that was

437
00:20:22,230 --> 00:20:19,840
upsetting just knowing that that poor

438
00:20:25,470 --> 00:20:22,240
Cecily she's lost a child you know and

439
00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:25,480
she has to endure that kind of yeah that

440
00:20:30,630 --> 00:20:27,850
kind of abuse and that this sort of

441
00:20:34,470 --> 00:20:30,640
disrespect but that's that's

442
00:20:36,810 --> 00:20:34,480
unfortunately that's that's a lot of the

443
00:20:40,170 --> 00:20:36,820
people in this region that's the way

444
00:20:42,300 --> 00:20:40,180
they they act and that's the way they

445
00:20:44,430 --> 00:20:42,310
view the whole vaccination issue and

446
00:20:46,980 --> 00:20:44,440
they do deny the science so yeah it's

447
00:20:49,230 --> 00:20:46,990
just an it's a battle it's an onward and

448
00:20:50,910 --> 00:20:49,240
upward battle and we won't give up it's

449
00:20:54,300 --> 00:20:50,920
just a setback in the grand scheme of

450
00:20:56,520 --> 00:20:54,310
things I guess so but it's interesting

451
00:20:57,840 --> 00:20:56,530
what you described is their behavior

452
00:20:59,780 --> 00:20:57,850
that's par for the course that's how

453
00:21:01,770 --> 00:20:59,790
these people behave a lot at the time

454
00:21:04,290 --> 00:21:01,780
we've seen that and there are videos

455
00:21:05,970 --> 00:21:04,300
online of them destroying meetings and

456
00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:05,980
heckling and screaming and yelling and

457
00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:08,770
carrying on I guess you know some of

458
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:10,210
them are quite passionate and they get

459
00:21:15,810 --> 00:21:11,530
carried away with their own

460
00:21:18,390 --> 00:21:15,820
self-righteousness yeah I think so I

461
00:21:20,550 --> 00:21:18,400
don't think it's I don't I don't think

462
00:21:23,460 --> 00:21:20,560
it helps I don't think it helps there

463
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:23,470
well maybe it does because they won the

464
00:21:31,620 --> 00:21:27,970
vote to them but you know I think it we

465
00:21:34,290 --> 00:21:31,630
certainly a 10 RBS we try and you know

466
00:21:37,500 --> 00:21:34,300
take pride in maintaining our composure

467
00:21:41,430 --> 00:21:37,510
and remaining calm and relatively

468
00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:41,440
emotion free at these at these kinds of

469
00:21:45,360 --> 00:21:43,210
things like the Senate hearing and

470
00:21:48,750 --> 00:21:45,370
another council meeting I spoke out a

471
00:21:50,820 --> 00:21:48,760
few years ago and you know that's all

472
00:21:55,050 --> 00:21:50,830
that's all we can do I refer certainly

473
00:21:58,140 --> 00:21:55,060
refuse to just hollering and jeering and

474
00:22:01,050 --> 00:21:58,150
being disrespectful to people whilst

475
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:01,060
they're talking even even the

476
00:22:04,950 --> 00:22:03,850
anti-vaxxers but they don't seem to

477
00:22:08,340 --> 00:22:04,960
exist

478
00:22:10,649 --> 00:22:08,350
the same courtesy to us oh well look

479
00:22:12,539 --> 00:22:10,659
Heidi don't worry your reward won't be

480
00:22:14,460 --> 00:22:12,549
in heaven it'll be in Sydney and I'll

481
00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:14,470
buy you an extra extra glass of

482
00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:15,970
champagne when you're here ah

483
00:22:21,539 --> 00:22:19,450
thank you I look forward to it okay well

484
00:22:24,090 --> 00:22:21,549
Heidi well again well done it's it's a

485
00:22:26,100 --> 00:22:24,100
very difficult road that we have but

486
00:22:28,260 --> 00:22:26,110
that's just the way it is but for now

487
00:22:31,139 --> 00:22:28,270
until we see you very soon Heidi

488
00:22:48,659 --> 00:22:31,149
Robertson thank you very much thank you

489
00:22:50,909 --> 00:22:48,669
bye hey you fellow skeptics in Medford

490
00:22:53,159 --> 00:22:50,919
here with Celeste reward your friendly

491
00:22:54,659 --> 00:22:53,169
host of starting the strange a podcast

492
00:22:57,690 --> 00:22:54,669
that looks at topics ranging from

493
00:22:59,909 --> 00:22:57,700
legends panics and cryptids to myths

494
00:23:01,980 --> 00:22:59,919
psychology and folklore breaking things

495
00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:01,990
down and picking things apart as we

496
00:23:06,389 --> 00:23:04,090
skeptics do we bring a few different

497
00:23:08,850 --> 00:23:06,399
perspectives on things pleasure for

498
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:08,860
example is a witty cartoonist and Ben is

499
00:23:12,210 --> 00:23:09,970
a brilliant writer and longtime

500
00:23:14,639 --> 00:23:12,220
skeptical investigator we don't always

501
00:23:16,889 --> 00:23:14,649
agree but we have fun trying and we

502
00:23:19,529 --> 00:23:16,899
learn new things join us for new topics

503
00:23:21,810 --> 00:23:19,539
every week or two or browse our backlog

504
00:23:24,419 --> 00:23:21,820
of evergreen episodes available on

505
00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:24,429
iTunes and all your podcast feeding

506
00:23:30,430 --> 00:23:26,890
troughs squaring the strange take care

507
00:23:48,789 --> 00:23:46,539
a few weeks ago I told you all about the

508
00:23:51,220 --> 00:23:48,799
fact that a flyer was appearing in

509
00:23:54,330 --> 00:23:51,230
Sydney letter boxes predicting doom and

510
00:23:58,210 --> 00:23:54,340
gloom for Sydney tsunami specifically

511
00:24:02,019 --> 00:23:58,220
that would strike at 9 p.m. on the 20th

512
00:24:04,419 --> 00:24:02,029
Thursday the 20th of September well

513
00:24:08,049 --> 00:24:04,429
needless to say Thursday the 20th of

514
00:24:11,490 --> 00:24:08,059
September came and went and no tsunami

515
00:24:15,190 --> 00:24:11,500
reported now this prediction which

516
00:24:17,950 --> 00:24:15,200
included the loss of many lives reminded

517
00:24:21,039 --> 00:24:17,960
me of the ongoing problem in society

518
00:24:22,389 --> 00:24:21,049
where people or groups predict the end

519
00:24:27,399 --> 00:24:22,399
of the world or doom and gloom or

520
00:24:29,289 --> 00:24:27,409
disaster and prompted me and Trish Hann

521
00:24:33,300 --> 00:24:29,299
and Tim Mendham from the Australian

522
00:24:37,799 --> 00:24:33,310
skeptics to write this opinion piece

523
00:24:43,690 --> 00:24:40,330
from the website of Australian skeptics

524
00:24:46,740 --> 00:24:43,700
skeptics calm today you published on the

525
00:24:49,619 --> 00:24:46,750
21st of September 2018

526
00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:49,629
Dateline Australia for immediate release

527
00:24:56,860 --> 00:24:53,330
tsunami hits Sydney yesterday September

528
00:24:59,320 --> 00:24:56,870
the 20th 2018 at 8 p.m. at tsunami

529
00:25:01,690 --> 00:24:59,330
wrecked havoc along the New South Wales

530
00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:01,700
coast from Newcastle in the north to

531
00:25:07,629 --> 00:25:05,090
Nara in the South huge regions of Sydney

532
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:07,639
were devastated including the seaside

533
00:25:13,419 --> 00:25:10,970
suburbs of Cronulla Bondi and manly the

534
00:25:15,279 --> 00:25:13,429
tsunami surge also wiped out in a

535
00:25:17,590 --> 00:25:15,289
harbour suburbs such as Balmain and

536
00:25:19,570 --> 00:25:17,600
kirribilli destroyed the Sydney Harbour

537
00:25:21,999 --> 00:25:19,580
Bridge as well as the airport and

538
00:25:24,700 --> 00:25:22,009
flooded the central business district

539
00:25:27,310 --> 00:25:24,710
waves reached as far inland as

540
00:25:29,560 --> 00:25:27,320
Parramatta more destruction followed

541
00:25:31,869 --> 00:25:29,570
immediately after with an earthquake

542
00:25:34,149 --> 00:25:31,879
destroying more suburbs such as newtown

543
00:25:37,899 --> 00:25:34,159
it is estimated that the loss of life

544
00:25:39,609 --> 00:25:37,909
numbers around 400,000 with the

545
00:25:43,870 --> 00:25:39,619
government imposing a state of martial

546
00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:43,880
law ends missed this new

547
00:25:48,490 --> 00:25:45,890
didn't notice the destruction last night

548
00:25:51,310 --> 00:25:48,500
not surprising as once again dire

549
00:25:54,070 --> 00:25:51,320
predictions of doom failed to eventuate

550
00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:54,080
the above disaster comes from a flyer

551
00:25:58,720 --> 00:25:56,690
placed in many letter boxes in Sydney in

552
00:26:01,540 --> 00:25:58,730
the months leading up to yesterday the

553
00:26:03,670 --> 00:26:01,550
20th of September not only that a lone

554
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:03,680
figure of a man complete with microphone

555
00:26:08,310 --> 00:26:06,170
and amplifier was seen around the Sydney

556
00:26:11,740 --> 00:26:08,320
Town Hall on several occasions loudly

557
00:26:14,380 --> 00:26:11,750
proclaiming this prediction behind him

558
00:26:17,110 --> 00:26:14,390
stood a banner that read quote warning

559
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:17,120
tsunami to hit Sydney 20th of September

560
00:26:23,530 --> 00:26:20,290
2018 impact 9 p.m.

561
00:26:26,410 --> 00:26:23,540
400,000 lives lost everyone that calls

562
00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:26,420
upon the name of the Lord shall be saved

563
00:26:32,710 --> 00:26:29,930
Jesus is Lord in quote his warnings were

564
00:26:34,510 --> 00:26:32,720
punctuated with calls to be saved in the

565
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:34,520
name of Jesus songs of praise and

566
00:26:40,360 --> 00:26:37,330
rambling about heaven hell and

567
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:40,370
unbelievers while it would be easy to

568
00:26:46,930 --> 00:26:43,010
dismiss this self-proclaimed prophet as

569
00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:46,940
a nutcase or lunatic clearly to go to so

570
00:26:52,150 --> 00:26:49,570
much trouble he was and maybe still is

571
00:26:55,390 --> 00:26:52,160
sincere in his opinion that Sydney was

572
00:26:58,000 --> 00:26:55,400
in peril for whatever reason and his

573
00:27:00,580 --> 00:26:58,010
sincerity and message can have

574
00:27:02,860 --> 00:27:00,590
far-reaching and serious impacts for

575
00:27:05,020 --> 00:27:02,870
some members of his audience while the

576
00:27:06,940 --> 00:27:05,030
vast majority of people who receive the

577
00:27:09,670 --> 00:27:06,950
flyer or saw this man in the street

578
00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:09,680
would either ignore him and the message

579
00:27:15,100 --> 00:27:11,690
or make the odd joke about buying a boat

580
00:27:18,010 --> 00:27:15,110
just in case for some people a message

581
00:27:20,890 --> 00:27:18,020
of impending doom is no laughing matter

582
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:20,900
thanatophobia is the irrational fear of

583
00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:23,690
dying often associated with the concern

584
00:27:29,230 --> 00:27:26,930
about the apocalypse this fear can

585
00:27:32,110 --> 00:27:29,240
overwhelm people may be suffering from

586
00:27:35,650 --> 00:27:32,120
anxiety depression or other mental

587
00:27:37,930 --> 00:27:35,660
disorders and it can be exacerbated by

588
00:27:40,360 --> 00:27:37,940
news social media or religious

589
00:27:42,700 --> 00:27:40,370
prophecies stress is often brought on by

590
00:27:44,980 --> 00:27:42,710
a feeling of being out of control with

591
00:27:47,230 --> 00:27:44,990
people attempting to take a small amount

592
00:27:50,620 --> 00:27:47,240
of control by doing whatever they can to

593
00:27:54,460 --> 00:27:50,630
prepare for what they feel is impending

594
00:27:57,460 --> 00:27:54,470
doom the prepper or survivalist movement

595
00:27:57,880 --> 00:27:57,470
started in the USA and has made its way

596
00:28:00,700 --> 00:27:57,890
to

597
00:28:03,010 --> 00:28:00,710
Australia with apparently hundreds of

598
00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:03,020
Doomsday Preppers across the country

599
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:05,810
making preparations for the coming

600
00:28:11,230 --> 00:28:09,050
apocalypse this could be argued as being

601
00:28:14,520 --> 00:28:11,240
harmless but people suffering from

602
00:28:17,530 --> 00:28:14,530
anxiety are at increased risk of

603
00:28:19,980 --> 00:28:17,540
manifesting their fears by resorting to

604
00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:19,990
dangerous activities such as financial

605
00:28:26,010 --> 00:28:23,690
self-sabotage social isolation alcohol

606
00:28:28,690 --> 00:28:26,020
and substance abuse and self-harm

607
00:28:31,420 --> 00:28:28,700
doomsday phobias can even lead to

608
00:28:34,330 --> 00:28:31,430
suicidal ideation and in extreme cases

609
00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:34,340
sufferers may take the only control they

610
00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:37,090
feel they have and in their own lives

611
00:28:41,590 --> 00:28:40,130
various doomsday cults have taken

612
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:41,600
advantage of vulnerable people and

613
00:28:46,870 --> 00:28:43,370
convinced them to sell their possessions

614
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:46,880
so they can donate money to cult leaders

615
00:28:52,690 --> 00:28:49,850
this predatory behavior is abhorrent and

616
00:28:55,630 --> 00:28:52,700
while we are not suggesting the latest

617
00:28:57,970 --> 00:28:55,640
prophecy is doing that they are

618
00:29:00,300 --> 00:28:57,980
certainly not helping Australia has had

619
00:29:02,740 --> 00:29:00,310
its fair share of predictions of doom

620
00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:02,750
ranging from the second coming of Jesus

621
00:29:08,140 --> 00:29:06,050
Christ in 1927 Christ was going to

622
00:29:10,420 --> 00:29:08,150
descend from the clouds between the

623
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:10,430
heads of Sydney Harbor to the family

624
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:12,970
radio billboards on Parramatta Road in

625
00:29:19,570 --> 00:29:16,490
2011 warning of impending disaster in

626
00:29:22,450 --> 00:29:19,580
May of that year the one thing all these

627
00:29:27,010 --> 00:29:22,460
predictions too many to number have in

628
00:29:29,860 --> 00:29:27,020
common is their 100% failure rate while

629
00:29:32,380 --> 00:29:29,870
we may pity the lone prophet we should

630
00:29:35,170 --> 00:29:32,390
also be aware that there are many people

631
00:29:38,590 --> 00:29:35,180
who often in secret will take the

632
00:29:40,780 --> 00:29:38,600
doomsday message to heart and adversely

633
00:29:43,660 --> 00:29:40,790
affect their lives and the lives of

634
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:43,670
those around them in so doing as

635
00:29:49,370 --> 00:29:46,730
tempting as it is doomsday is no

636
00:29:53,490 --> 00:29:49,380
laughing matter

637
00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:53,500
and that item was written by Trish Han

638
00:29:59,639 --> 00:29:56,010
Tim Mendham and Richard Saunders and

639
00:30:28,560 --> 00:29:59,649
published at skeptics calm dot a you on

640
00:30:30,570 --> 00:30:28,570
the 21st of September 2018 hi eyes

641
00:30:32,460 --> 00:30:30,580
beyond Chanakya GP and to be a

642
00:30:35,159 --> 00:30:32,470
commentator and a looking forward to

643
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:35,169
coming down to skeptic on 2018 to share

644
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:37,450
with you my new talk what doctors don't

645
00:30:41,490 --> 00:30:39,970
know I don't know title sample click

646
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:41,500
maybe something you might expect from a

647
00:30:45,419 --> 00:30:43,210
conspiracy theorist but no I actually

648
00:30:47,789 --> 00:30:45,429
will be discussing things that doctors

649
00:30:49,470 --> 00:30:47,799
don't know you don't need my first year

650
00:30:52,379 --> 00:30:49,480
of medical school we were given this

651
00:30:53,430 --> 00:30:52,389
introductory lecture by the Dean and he

652
00:30:55,620 --> 00:30:53,440
ended with some really interesting

653
00:30:58,049 --> 00:30:55,630
remarks he said that by the time you

654
00:31:00,960 --> 00:30:58,059
guys graduate half of what you know will

655
00:31:03,509 --> 00:31:00,970
either be out of date or be proven wrong

656
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:03,519
completely and we kind of laughed about

657
00:31:08,850 --> 00:31:06,010
it but by the time I graduated it was a

658
00:31:10,919 --> 00:31:08,860
scary thought I had so much certainty

659
00:31:13,620 --> 00:31:10,929
then everything that I've learned that

660
00:31:15,659 --> 00:31:13,630
the idea that half of what I knew it was

661
00:31:18,659 --> 00:31:15,669
out of date or worse still completely

662
00:31:20,519 --> 00:31:18,669
wrong it was just unimaginable but of

663
00:31:22,860 --> 00:31:20,529
course after practicing medicine for a

664
00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:22,870
decade I start to see examples of this

665
00:31:27,269 --> 00:31:25,210
kind of trickle through so what I wanted

666
00:31:29,909 --> 00:31:27,279
to share with you guys was current

667
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:29,919
medical practices and beliefs off

668
00:31:35,039 --> 00:31:33,010
doctors right now that are either not

669
00:31:37,649 --> 00:31:35,049
based on evidence or that's even

670
00:31:39,539 --> 00:31:37,659
completely contradicted by the evidence

671
00:31:40,270 --> 00:31:39,549
and I'll be sharing some really new and

672
00:31:42,130 --> 00:31:40,280
interesting

673
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:42,140
examples of things perhaps rather even

674
00:31:46,780 --> 00:31:43,970
heard of everything from the placebo

675
00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:46,790
effect to appendicitis but I kind of

676
00:31:51,340 --> 00:31:48,050
want to keep some of the best examples

677
00:31:53,290 --> 00:31:51,350
for one real mile in the theater in the

678
00:31:55,330 --> 00:31:53,300
talk itself so I really look forward to

679
00:31:59,040 --> 00:31:55,340
meeting you guys at skeptic on 2018 come

680
00:31:59,050 --> 00:32:06,010
[Music]

681
00:32:13,470 --> 00:32:10,750
here's Maynard spooky action at a

682
00:32:16,989 --> 00:32:15,549
and of course as I look around here I

683
00:32:18,850 --> 00:32:16,999
see the person who'll be talking here

684
00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:18,860
tonight who we got here and what we'd be

685
00:32:21,850 --> 00:32:20,210
talking about will have a longer chat

686
00:32:23,230 --> 00:32:21,860
after you talk because there'll be the

687
00:32:24,279 --> 00:32:23,240
right people we'll be putting out

688
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:24,289
cigarette butts on you it'll get pretty

689
00:32:29,379 --> 00:32:26,210
wild but what are you gonna be chatting

690
00:32:31,509 --> 00:32:29,389
about and who are you okay so a year at

691
00:32:34,269 --> 00:32:31,519
among my name is Nathan senate's I'm a

692
00:32:37,060 --> 00:32:34,279
wagering man from Central West New South

693
00:32:38,710 --> 00:32:37,070
Wales that's where my family's from so I

694
00:32:41,110 --> 00:32:38,720
work at the Australian Museum in First

695
00:32:43,509 --> 00:32:41,120
Nations programs and projects and what

696
00:32:46,060 --> 00:32:43,519
I'm going to talk about tonight is how

697
00:32:47,889 --> 00:32:46,070
do we promote critical thinking to

698
00:32:53,529 --> 00:32:47,899
visitors of places like the Australian

699
00:32:55,779 --> 00:32:53,539
Museum State Archives national and state

700
00:32:57,820 --> 00:32:55,789
libraries places that people look to for

701
00:32:59,680 --> 00:32:57,830
history and pour and think of as

702
00:33:01,779 --> 00:32:59,690
authority of sources how do we get them

703
00:33:03,220 --> 00:33:01,789
to be more critical of the information

704
00:33:05,470 --> 00:33:03,230
that they receive from these places and

705
00:33:06,580 --> 00:33:05,480
from the outside world yes because you

706
00:33:07,690 --> 00:33:06,590
got a look at who was writing the

707
00:33:09,129 --> 00:33:07,700
history a bit like when you have to

708
00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:09,139
channel our news you've got to say who's

709
00:33:13,180 --> 00:33:11,090
telling me this yeah and that's kind of

710
00:33:15,100 --> 00:33:13,190
what I look at is like every exhibition

711
00:33:18,070 --> 00:33:15,110
at the shreya Museum is curated by

712
00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:18,080
someone and we all have our individual

713
00:33:22,239 --> 00:33:20,090
views on things and how do we promote

714
00:33:25,239 --> 00:33:22,249
people not just taking everything they

715
00:33:26,950 --> 00:33:25,249
hear as fact but also what I want to

716
00:33:28,180 --> 00:33:26,960
find out from the people here today

717
00:33:30,399 --> 00:33:28,190
because I'm gonna be surrounded by

718
00:33:32,019 --> 00:33:30,409
skeptics is how do I achieve this but

719
00:33:34,359 --> 00:33:32,029
also how do I create a healthy balance

720
00:33:35,799 --> 00:33:34,369
so not how do I get people to be

721
00:33:37,690 --> 00:33:35,809
critical of institutions but at the same

722
00:33:39,129 --> 00:33:37,700
time not disregarding institutions

723
00:33:41,730 --> 00:33:39,139
completely and feed into things like

724
00:33:44,409 --> 00:33:41,740
climate change denial and you know

725
00:33:45,999 --> 00:33:44,419
anti-vaccination people how do i but at

726
00:33:47,649 --> 00:33:46,009
the same time get them to be more

727
00:33:49,629 --> 00:33:47,659
understanding off the darle receiving to

728
00:33:51,129 --> 00:33:49,639
be more critical because especially we

729
00:33:54,460 --> 00:33:51,139
have like say stuff like scientific

730
00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:54,470
journalism people because of the how

731
00:33:58,060 --> 00:33:56,210
poor it's done and how easily can be

732
00:34:00,909 --> 00:33:58,070
disregarded people start disregarding

733
00:34:02,169 --> 00:34:00,919
science completely and I'll be talking

734
00:34:04,539 --> 00:34:02,179
mostly from the First Nations

735
00:34:06,100 --> 00:34:04,549
perspective because a lot of um First

736
00:34:07,720 --> 00:34:06,110
Nations people are now getting more

737
00:34:09,149 --> 00:34:07,730
control we're getting more control of

738
00:34:11,649 --> 00:34:09,159
the history told by these institutions

739
00:34:13,119 --> 00:34:11,659
so we want to be able to be able to tell

740
00:34:16,149 --> 00:34:13,129
our side the story and the story that's

741
00:34:17,319 --> 00:34:16,159
been absent for a while so do you think

742
00:34:19,030 --> 00:34:17,329
there'll ever be a time when there will

743
00:34:21,010 --> 00:34:19,040
be a really complete both sides told

744
00:34:22,550 --> 00:34:21,020
about things like the frontiers war and

745
00:34:24,500 --> 00:34:22,560
that sort of thing I think it's

746
00:34:25,850 --> 00:34:24,510
coming more and more likely and one of

747
00:34:28,100 --> 00:34:25,860
the interesting things I'm finding is

748
00:34:29,690 --> 00:34:28,110
actually a lot of archives in places

749
00:34:31,340 --> 00:34:29,700
like that actually do have that history

750
00:34:35,060 --> 00:34:31,350
but for some reason it's not talked

751
00:34:36,650 --> 00:34:35,070
about enough but I think because what I

752
00:34:38,780 --> 00:34:36,660
want to do is I don't want to disregard

753
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:38,790
the archive like I said what I want to

754
00:34:42,710 --> 00:34:40,890
do is create a space for pluralism to be

755
00:34:45,970 --> 00:34:42,720
happening and so people have multiple

756
00:34:49,250 --> 00:34:45,980
sources and not think of like a single

757
00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:49,260
document to be the sole truth and for

758
00:34:53,510 --> 00:34:51,450
more critical thought of history books

759
00:34:55,460 --> 00:34:53,520
that you do things like and there are

760
00:34:57,260 --> 00:34:55,470
like great historians out there who do

761
00:35:00,140 --> 00:34:57,270
criticize people who you know use single

762
00:35:02,060 --> 00:35:00,150
source documentation to do history books

763
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:02,070
and stuff like that something I'd like

764
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:03,930
to ask you about as an archivist if you

765
00:35:08,420 --> 00:35:06,210
go to a lot of libraries on the local

766
00:35:10,550 --> 00:35:08,430
level um there's a lot of good oral

767
00:35:11,720 --> 00:35:10,560
history recordings there and they will

768
00:35:13,130 --> 00:35:11,730
actually carry a lot of weight because

769
00:35:14,450 --> 00:35:13,140
authors are recording the voice of

770
00:35:16,370 --> 00:35:14,460
someone talking about something that

771
00:35:18,770 --> 00:35:16,380
happened in the 30s and not a lot of

772
00:35:19,550 --> 00:35:18,780
thinking goes into well they may be

773
00:35:22,580 --> 00:35:19,560
incorrect

774
00:35:24,740 --> 00:35:22,590
yeah well that that's the case I know I

775
00:35:26,180 --> 00:35:24,750
have a lot of funny ideas well that's

776
00:35:28,670 --> 00:35:26,190
like that can always be the case when

777
00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:28,680
people tell a story sometimes you're not

778
00:35:31,490 --> 00:35:30,210
actually remembering things should tell

779
00:35:35,240 --> 00:35:31,500
you're remembering the last time you

780
00:35:37,460 --> 00:35:35,250
told that story so so of course but this

781
00:35:38,720 --> 00:35:37,470
is why everything in archives and

782
00:35:41,510 --> 00:35:38,730
libraries and museums should be

783
00:35:43,370 --> 00:35:41,520
considered almost complimentary off each

784
00:35:44,450 --> 00:35:43,380
other so you need to have lots of

785
00:35:47,630 --> 00:35:44,460
different sources to create a whole

786
00:35:49,250 --> 00:35:47,640
picture and um and if something is the

787
00:35:53,750 --> 00:35:49,260
only source on one topic that you know

788
00:35:56,780 --> 00:35:53,760
of we need to create a way to make

789
00:35:58,880 --> 00:35:56,790
people more state that more obviously if

790
00:36:00,980 --> 00:35:58,890
you're citing one person for your thing

791
00:36:03,410 --> 00:36:00,990
make that more obvious but also give

792
00:36:05,810 --> 00:36:03,420
people the empower people enough the

793
00:36:06,980 --> 00:36:05,820
tools to look at that and say no they're

794
00:36:08,630 --> 00:36:06,990
really only starting this one guy's

795
00:36:11,420 --> 00:36:08,640
Journal they're they're only saying this

796
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:11,430
one oral history and so then they can

797
00:36:15,350 --> 00:36:13,410
sort of you know take those sort of

798
00:36:18,290 --> 00:36:15,360
things with a grain of salt like because

799
00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:18,300
yeah okay smarty bum what would you

800
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:19,770
think would be an example we could point

801
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:21,450
to as someone who's done this correctly

802
00:36:24,020 --> 00:36:23,010
with the history anywhere in the world

803
00:36:26,720 --> 00:36:24,030
is there someone you could say but

804
00:36:29,490 --> 00:36:26,730
that's a good example to follow

805
00:36:30,690 --> 00:36:29,500
out of history documentaries and now I

806
00:36:33,390 --> 00:36:30,700
think really doing it like I was just

807
00:36:34,710 --> 00:36:33,400
talking to a filmmaker historian last

808
00:36:37,610 --> 00:36:34,720
night I forgot a name but she was

809
00:36:41,340 --> 00:36:37,620
talking about how she was deliberately

810
00:36:42,510 --> 00:36:41,350
avoiding recreation in our in our

811
00:36:44,340 --> 00:36:42,520
history documentaries because she was

812
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:44,350
funny as soon as she started recreations

813
00:36:48,300 --> 00:36:46,210
it would plant more ideas about I think

814
00:36:51,180 --> 00:36:48,310
and it's basically is a interpretation

815
00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:51,190
off the text so they were talking about

816
00:36:55,950 --> 00:36:53,530
maybe using history documentaries more

817
00:36:58,650 --> 00:36:55,960
exploratory and more like art to you

818
00:37:00,150 --> 00:36:58,660
know to tell stories but also to give

819
00:37:01,890 --> 00:37:00,160
the viewer more of a sense that this is

820
00:37:03,810 --> 00:37:01,900
you know it may not be completely

821
00:37:05,970 --> 00:37:03,820
fiction but at the same time there is

822
00:37:08,580 --> 00:37:05,980
someone that's creating this so of

823
00:37:10,710 --> 00:37:08,590
course like you know people do have

824
00:37:13,200 --> 00:37:10,720
people naturally have confirmation bias

825
00:37:14,490 --> 00:37:13,210
so it's natural to disregard some

826
00:37:16,980 --> 00:37:14,500
stories that don't fit the narrative

827
00:37:18,660 --> 00:37:16,990
that you want to tell and I think as

828
00:37:20,190 --> 00:37:18,670
long as we give people the tools to

829
00:37:21,510 --> 00:37:20,200
understand that then they can look at

830
00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:21,520
things like history documentaries and

831
00:37:27,240 --> 00:37:23,650
not repeat them all in the future as if

832
00:37:28,290 --> 00:37:27,250
they're complete fact and yeah well

833
00:37:29,570 --> 00:37:28,300
thank you I'm looking forward to your

834
00:37:31,890 --> 00:37:29,580
talk Thanks

835
00:37:33,180 --> 00:37:31,900
well Nathan congratulations on the check

836
00:37:34,860 --> 00:37:33,190
went quite well you went three rounds

837
00:37:37,110 --> 00:37:34,870
with the skeptics and you came out

838
00:37:38,100 --> 00:37:37,120
besting them all there my question was

839
00:37:40,650 --> 00:37:38,110
obviously the best one

840
00:37:42,030 --> 00:37:40,660
I asked about revisionism in history

841
00:37:43,980 --> 00:37:42,040
particularly at the Austrian Museum

842
00:37:45,390 --> 00:37:43,990
people might have a political agenda to

843
00:37:46,890 --> 00:37:45,400
push and has to be someone who's a

844
00:37:48,300 --> 00:37:46,900
gatekeeper and that's a tough one

845
00:37:51,990 --> 00:37:48,310
because someone has to say no at some

846
00:37:53,820 --> 00:37:52,000
stage that they air as I was saying

847
00:37:56,220 --> 00:37:53,830
before like who are these people writing

848
00:37:58,710 --> 00:37:56,230
history and even if even if we've got a

849
00:38:02,130 --> 00:37:58,720
crazy revision that's in how do we

850
00:38:04,440 --> 00:38:02,140
figure out mechanisms to stop that their

851
00:38:07,350 --> 00:38:04,450
revision been considered he's like

852
00:38:09,180 --> 00:38:07,360
history or fact like how do we stop just

853
00:38:10,870 --> 00:38:09,190
one sole source or one single person's

854
00:38:13,210 --> 00:38:10,880
ideology

855
00:38:14,859 --> 00:38:13,220
being considered facts and that's why we

856
00:38:17,079 --> 00:38:14,869
was talking about things are like naming

857
00:38:22,599 --> 00:38:17,089
parks so then like even if I am a crazy

858
00:38:25,749 --> 00:38:22,609
religious my my ideology can be at least

859
00:38:29,109 --> 00:38:25,759
critically examined and so the the facts

860
00:38:31,150 --> 00:38:29,119
that I'm saying can be weighed up

861
00:38:32,769 --> 00:38:31,160
against my ideology so you can take what

862
00:38:34,900 --> 00:38:32,779
I'm saying with a grain of salt and just

863
00:38:36,910 --> 00:38:34,910
know like Oh Nathan really like this

864
00:38:39,160 --> 00:38:36,920
subject so of course Nathan thinks this

865
00:38:40,509 --> 00:38:39,170
is the best or you know Nathan was

866
00:38:42,910 --> 00:38:40,519
selling like a weight-loss powder that

867
00:38:46,420 --> 00:38:42,920
was um this so of course you would say

868
00:38:48,849 --> 00:38:46,430
that you know more fat Nathan's up to

869
00:38:50,799 --> 00:38:48,859
troublemaker and also the the use of

870
00:38:52,660 --> 00:38:50,809
words to Allah we would have called it

871
00:38:54,370 --> 00:38:52,670
Aboriginal history and I've heard

872
00:38:56,140 --> 00:38:54,380
indigenous history and I've heard using

873
00:38:58,089 --> 00:38:56,150
the First Nation history which I

874
00:39:00,880 --> 00:38:58,099
immediately think back to the American

875
00:39:02,019 --> 00:39:00,890
Indian experience and and is that now a

876
00:39:03,579 --> 00:39:02,029
word that would be used instead of

877
00:39:06,009 --> 00:39:03,589
indigenous is there a political problem

878
00:39:08,259 --> 00:39:06,019
with the word indigenous no I actually

879
00:39:09,789 --> 00:39:08,269
don't mind the word indigenous I just

880
00:39:12,370 --> 00:39:09,799
personally like the word First Nations

881
00:39:14,650 --> 00:39:12,380
although a lot of our Aboriginal torture

882
00:39:15,849 --> 00:39:14,660
Islanders actually think that don't like

883
00:39:17,890 --> 00:39:15,859
the word indigenous because I think it's

884
00:39:21,700 --> 00:39:17,900
like a governmental words instead okay

885
00:39:23,559 --> 00:39:21,710
but I like First Nations more - more for

886
00:39:25,980 --> 00:39:23,569
the imagery of like because there are

887
00:39:29,319 --> 00:39:25,990
like a multitude of plans multitude of

888
00:39:31,329 --> 00:39:29,329
languages and I'd like us to be thought

889
00:39:33,339 --> 00:39:31,339
of almost as different nations in

890
00:39:34,660 --> 00:39:33,349
Australia and to try and promote that

891
00:39:36,490 --> 00:39:34,670
imagery in - because there is a

892
00:39:38,829 --> 00:39:36,500
diversity of Aboriginal culture it's not

893
00:39:41,470 --> 00:39:38,839
a single culture or some language so I

894
00:39:43,420 --> 00:39:41,480
think using the terminology of nations

895
00:39:45,099 --> 00:39:43,430
when it sort of puts the idea of

896
00:39:48,490 --> 00:39:45,109
different countries of different nations

897
00:39:50,319 --> 00:39:48,500
of ebiz mind because with them with

898
00:39:52,509 --> 00:39:50,329
First Nations can we be sure they were

899
00:39:54,460 --> 00:39:52,519
the first nation was there anybody here

900
00:39:56,109 --> 00:39:54,470
mucking around when they came along the

901
00:39:57,849 --> 00:39:56,119
Brooklyn Bridge did they was there some

902
00:40:00,730 --> 00:39:57,859
issues going on there or that's just so

903
00:40:02,710 --> 00:40:00,740
far ago in before pre Dreamtime that we

904
00:40:05,170 --> 00:40:02,720
don't even know I know there is it's a

905
00:40:06,220 --> 00:40:05,180
contestant history icon there is an

906
00:40:08,270 --> 00:40:06,230
archaeologist that works at the

907
00:40:10,850 --> 00:40:08,280
Australian Museum called

908
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:10,860
so now it's about Adam Brock Valentin

909
00:40:13,700 --> 00:40:12,450
brow we can test that average of people

910
00:40:16,730 --> 00:40:13,710
we're not the first people of this land

911
00:40:18,470 --> 00:40:16,740
but it's it's very interesting like I'm

912
00:40:20,270 --> 00:40:18,480
but there is a contestant and I think

913
00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:20,280
what we can do is we can just highlight

914
00:40:24,170 --> 00:40:22,410
that contestant we don't need to say

915
00:40:26,330 --> 00:40:24,180
definitively what we can but we can

916
00:40:28,370 --> 00:40:26,340
point the people to that confession and

917
00:40:31,220 --> 00:40:28,380
because there are there only are about

918
00:40:32,660 --> 00:40:31,230
three modes of thought around that sort

919
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:32,670
of topic to make the best of my

920
00:40:36,740 --> 00:40:34,650
knowledge it because it'd be scarcity of

921
00:40:41,270 --> 00:40:36,750
evidence other than like a protracted

922
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:41,280
oral history yeah and even Robert vows

923
00:40:46,670 --> 00:40:44,210
evidence is no not that much more than

924
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:46,680
thinking about patterns of other nations

925
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:49,530
so she's not really basing it on any

926
00:40:54,860 --> 00:40:51,690
like solid evidence though that either

927
00:40:56,780 --> 00:40:54,870
it's mainly just her hypothesis and and

928
00:40:58,220 --> 00:40:56,790
also people would say oh she might be

929
00:40:59,720 --> 00:40:58,230
politically motivated but I would

930
00:41:00,980 --> 00:40:59,730
suggest not if she's trying to get some

931
00:41:03,500 --> 00:41:00,990
evidence together with a proper top

932
00:41:05,210 --> 00:41:03,510
officers yes for sure that's the case

933
00:41:06,350 --> 00:41:05,220
but it was mainly other people who get

934
00:41:08,930 --> 00:41:06,360
up and run with it that might have

935
00:41:10,520 --> 00:41:08,940
another agenda well cuz I'm like if

936
00:41:12,590 --> 00:41:10,530
that's happen a lot where especially

937
00:41:14,510 --> 00:41:12,600
with different first nations there is

938
00:41:17,540 --> 00:41:14,520
like an idea like there is people that

939
00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:17,550
love the idea of people coming to

940
00:41:22,030 --> 00:41:19,010
different countries and taking it over

941
00:41:24,710 --> 00:41:22,040
because then people that have done that

942
00:41:26,630 --> 00:41:24,720
historically it can be said as part of

943
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:26,640
human nature like you know come on we

944
00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:28,410
call Niger but you took over who is

945
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:29,850
originally here come on there you go

946
00:41:35,450 --> 00:41:32,010
yeah yeah so there are people that could

947
00:41:37,340 --> 00:41:35,460
run with the hypothesis and I don't and

948
00:41:39,290 --> 00:41:37,350
they'll herself would not be that hard

949
00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:39,300
on that hypothesis but other people will

950
00:41:42,860 --> 00:41:41,130
take that for their own reason as a

951
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:42,870
saying with things I can say it could be

952
00:41:46,970 --> 00:41:45,210
taken by you know different activists

953
00:41:48,950 --> 00:41:46,980
for their own reasons to suffer there

954
00:41:50,180 --> 00:41:48,960
but we just need to that's what I want

955
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:50,190
to do I want to empower people to look

956
00:41:54,590 --> 00:41:52,890
beyond those people to go back to the

957
00:41:56,450 --> 00:41:54,600
source of what where their claims are

958
00:41:58,220 --> 00:41:56,460
coming from and to figure out what those

959
00:42:00,350 --> 00:41:58,230
people were saying in the first place or

960
00:42:02,150 --> 00:42:00,360
like why they were saying it and where

961
00:42:03,530 --> 00:42:02,160
can we find out more about what you're

962
00:42:04,730 --> 00:42:03,540
doing online and with the Australian

963
00:42:08,330 --> 00:42:04,740
Museum where we can find out what's

964
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:08,340
going on there maybe go so I am on

965
00:42:12,730 --> 00:42:10,850
Twitter at say what Nathan

966
00:42:16,390 --> 00:42:12,740
and I run a blog called the akhadas D

967
00:42:17,770 --> 00:42:16,400
colorless nice things well thank you

968
00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:17,780
very much for you Tom and thanks just

969
00:42:38,990 --> 00:42:19,370
talk news to not skeptics is about all

970
00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:46,280
[Applause]

971
00:42:51,110 --> 00:42:50,330
hey Richard oh hi Trish hi would you

972
00:42:52,580 --> 00:42:51,120
like a coffee

973
00:42:54,860 --> 00:42:52,590
yeah thanks what are you working on I'm

974
00:42:56,770 --> 00:42:54,870
trying to come up with a new promo to

975
00:43:00,140 --> 00:42:56,780
play on the sceptic zone who's it for

976
00:43:02,870 --> 00:43:00,150
the good thinking Society in the UK you

977
00:43:04,640 --> 00:43:02,880
know the oh yeah I know them the guys

978
00:43:06,740 --> 00:43:04,650
who recently chased the homeopaths out

979
00:43:08,810 --> 00:43:06,750
of the UK public health system oh did

980
00:43:09,980 --> 00:43:08,820
they yeah they campaigned and lobbied

981
00:43:13,130 --> 00:43:09,990
government for a while and now you

982
00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:13,140
cannot get homeopathy on the NHS so they

983
00:43:16,490 --> 00:43:14,490
can now spend public money on health

984
00:43:18,830 --> 00:43:16,500
care that works Yeah right look I'll

985
00:43:23,360 --> 00:43:18,840
mention that in the promo now their

986
00:43:25,250 --> 00:43:23,370
website is good thinking society org and

987
00:43:27,710 --> 00:43:25,260
that website is a good resource for

988
00:43:29,210 --> 00:43:27,720
learning more about quackery thanks

989
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:29,220
Trish that gives me something good to

990
00:43:38,850 --> 00:43:53,810
[Music]

991
00:43:58,200 --> 00:43:56,700
this report comes to us from the skeptic

992
00:44:02,600 --> 00:43:58,210
magazine the journal from Australian

993
00:44:07,410 --> 00:44:02,610
skeptics vol 38 number 2 from June 2018

994
00:44:09,570 --> 00:44:07,420
page 12 in the zone Richard Saunders

995
00:44:12,150 --> 00:44:09,580
reports on a milestone for Australia's

996
00:44:20,970 --> 00:44:12,160
leading sceptical podcast oh that's very

997
00:44:23,160 --> 00:44:20,980
nice over 500 weeks ago Stephane Soyka

998
00:44:23,760 --> 00:44:23,170
and I launched a new podcast onto the

999
00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:23,770
Internet

1000
00:44:28,200 --> 00:44:26,170
the skeptic zone was the latest in a

1001
00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:28,210
small line of sceptical information

1002
00:44:33,120 --> 00:44:30,130
shows I had produced since the early

1003
00:44:34,830 --> 00:44:33,130
2000s this was a result of various

1004
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:34,840
members of the Australian skeptics in

1005
00:44:39,930 --> 00:44:38,050
Sydney appearing on net FM an internet

1006
00:44:43,650 --> 00:44:39,940
radio station in which soy Cove worked

1007
00:44:45,870 --> 00:44:43,660
as a DJ as part of the show mostly

1008
00:44:47,880 --> 00:44:45,880
playing the latest hits he would have

1009
00:44:50,250 --> 00:44:47,890
members of the skeptics come in once a

1010
00:44:52,980 --> 00:44:50,260
week and interview us about sceptical

1011
00:44:57,360 --> 00:44:52,990
topics of interest mostly what we called

1012
00:45:00,930 --> 00:44:57,370
the classics ESP UFOs homeopathy and so

1013
00:45:04,380 --> 00:45:00,940
on this segment ran for the better part

1014
00:45:06,720 --> 00:45:04,390
of a year when it ended I still had a

1015
00:45:08,490 --> 00:45:06,730
desire to somehow maintain a presence on

1016
00:45:12,540 --> 00:45:08,500
the Internet in the form of a skeptical

1017
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:12,550
audio show so some months later Soyka

1018
00:45:19,050 --> 00:45:15,610
and I produced 10 or so shows in mp3

1019
00:45:21,870 --> 00:45:19,060
format called the skeptic tank these

1020
00:45:25,020 --> 00:45:21,880
were not really a podcast more of a file

1021
00:45:28,260 --> 00:45:25,030
people could download if they knew the

1022
00:45:31,020 --> 00:45:28,270
location early days after a time I tried

1023
00:45:33,450 --> 00:45:31,030
my hand at producing a similar idea only

1024
00:45:36,300 --> 00:45:33,460
this time it was a video show on the

1025
00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:36,310
Google video site that scientists since

1026
00:45:40,830 --> 00:45:37,810
stopped operating called

1027
00:45:43,380 --> 00:45:40,840
the tank vodcast the show had stories

1028
00:45:45,870 --> 00:45:43,390
reporters and interviews it however

1029
00:45:49,230 --> 00:45:45,880
proved to be an enormous undertaking to

1030
00:45:50,410 --> 00:45:49,240
produce and so only lasted about 10

1031
00:45:54,280 --> 00:45:50,420
episodes

1032
00:45:56,559 --> 00:45:54,290
then in mid 2008 at the amazing meeting

1033
00:45:58,690 --> 00:45:56,569
in Las Vegas I met podcasters Brian

1034
00:46:01,120 --> 00:45:58,700
Dunning from skeptoid podcast Derek and

1035
00:46:03,099 --> 00:46:01,130
swoopy from the skepticality podcast and

1036
00:46:05,740 --> 00:46:03,109
members of the skeptics guide to the

1037
00:46:08,470 --> 00:46:05,750
universe each of these people gave me

1038
00:46:11,140 --> 00:46:08,480
tips and encouragement about starting

1039
00:46:13,960 --> 00:46:11,150
again this time using the popular

1040
00:46:17,049 --> 00:46:13,970
podcasting platform of Lipson which not

1041
00:46:19,359 --> 00:46:17,059
only housed the mp3 files but also took

1042
00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:19,369
care of distribution people could sign

1043
00:46:24,039 --> 00:46:21,530
up for the podcast via iTunes for

1044
00:46:25,720 --> 00:46:24,049
example once back in Australia I asked

1045
00:46:28,329 --> 00:46:25,730
my friends what I should call the new

1046
00:46:30,789 --> 00:46:28,339
sceptical show for some time the show

1047
00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:30,799
was going to be called skipper think

1048
00:46:36,130 --> 00:46:33,290
uncle Stefan suka came up with the name

1049
00:46:38,440 --> 00:46:36,140
the skeptic zone it struck everyone as

1050
00:46:42,549 --> 00:46:38,450
being just the ticket and the show was

1051
00:46:45,069 --> 00:46:42,559
launched in September 2008 right from

1052
00:46:48,430 --> 00:46:45,079
the start I wanted a show with reporters

1053
00:46:50,890 --> 00:46:48,440
for variety and to supply content over

1054
00:46:53,289 --> 00:46:50,900
the years there have been around 20

1055
00:46:55,720 --> 00:46:53,299
reporters and I thank each and every one

1056
00:46:58,630 --> 00:46:55,730
of them with dr. Rachel Dunlop and her

1057
00:47:01,809 --> 00:46:58,640
segment dr. Ricci reports being with the

1058
00:47:04,839 --> 00:47:01,819
show since the beginning in more recent

1059
00:47:07,270 --> 00:47:04,849
years Maynard a real radio and TV star

1060
00:47:09,309 --> 00:47:07,280
with his spooky action segment has

1061
00:47:11,410 --> 00:47:09,319
filled many hours of the show with

1062
00:47:14,559 --> 00:47:11,420
interviews live reports in general

1063
00:47:16,359 --> 00:47:14,569
Maynard craziness the reporters and I

1064
00:47:18,579 --> 00:47:16,369
have had the chance to meet and

1065
00:47:21,789 --> 00:47:18,589
interview so many leaders in the science

1066
00:47:24,010 --> 00:47:21,799
and skeptical world from Stephen Fry dr.

1067
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:24,020
Pamela gay dr. Phil Plait dr. eugenie

1068
00:47:30,849 --> 00:47:27,890
Scott the list goes on and on into the

1069
00:47:33,390 --> 00:47:30,859
hundreds we have visited sceptical

1070
00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:33,400
conventions haunted locations

1071
00:47:38,140 --> 00:47:35,690
mind/body/spirit festivals paranormal

1072
00:47:40,990 --> 00:47:38,150
conventions another list that goes on

1073
00:47:43,180 --> 00:47:41,000
and on if you are interested to see if a

1074
00:47:46,539 --> 00:47:43,190
certain person has appeared on the show

1075
00:47:48,789 --> 00:47:46,549
visit skeptic zone TV click the episodes

1076
00:47:51,849 --> 00:47:48,799
link at the top and use the search

1077
00:47:54,579 --> 00:47:51,859
function donating time and energy the

1078
00:47:56,530 --> 00:47:54,589
show has also been used right from the

1079
00:47:58,150 --> 00:47:56,540
start to give free publicity to

1080
00:48:01,089 --> 00:47:58,160
sceptical events and to promote other

1081
00:48:02,620 --> 00:48:01,099
skeptical and science podcasts such as

1082
00:48:03,840 --> 00:48:02,630
skeptoid the skeptics guide to the

1083
00:48:06,930 --> 00:48:03,850
universe astronomy

1084
00:48:09,870 --> 00:48:06,940
skeptics with a k' the European skeptics

1085
00:48:12,240 --> 00:48:09,880
podcast and many more I remember Bob

1086
00:48:14,910 --> 00:48:12,250
novella telling me once that if one show

1087
00:48:16,860 --> 00:48:14,920
floats we all float and groups do not

1088
00:48:20,190 --> 00:48:16,870
ask for any of them to pay for these

1089
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:20,200
promotions the show does draw a modest

1090
00:48:24,780 --> 00:48:22,690
income from listeners who if they wish

1091
00:48:27,240 --> 00:48:24,790
sponsor the show with micro payments via

1092
00:48:29,340 --> 00:48:27,250
PayPal and patreon it's enough to cover

1093
00:48:31,590 --> 00:48:29,350
basic costs in let's me provide the

1094
00:48:34,170 --> 00:48:31,600
reporters with microphones and the odd

1095
00:48:36,240 --> 00:48:34,180
field trip for an investigation but all

1096
00:48:39,330 --> 00:48:36,250
of us on the show donate our time and

1097
00:48:41,420 --> 00:48:39,340
skills producing the show each week is a

1098
00:48:43,860 --> 00:48:41,430
matter of dedication and discipline

1099
00:48:45,810 --> 00:48:43,870
gathering files from reporters doing

1100
00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:45,820
voiceovers getting up at 4:00 a.m. to

1101
00:48:50,520 --> 00:48:47,650
interview someone in New York or London

1102
00:48:53,820 --> 00:48:50,530
or whatever editing mixing in the music

1103
00:48:55,920 --> 00:48:53,830
and finally uploading to the world once

1104
00:48:57,540 --> 00:48:55,930
or twice I have used the show to put out

1105
00:49:00,150 --> 00:48:57,550
a call for listeners to help cover the

1106
00:49:03,090 --> 00:49:00,160
cost of some special projects one of

1107
00:49:05,220 --> 00:49:03,100
these was the production costs in making

1108
00:49:07,260 --> 00:49:05,230
the vaccination Chronicles documentary

1109
00:49:09,540 --> 00:49:07,270
once this video was produced

1110
00:49:11,910 --> 00:49:09,550
I made it freely available on YouTube

1111
00:49:15,450 --> 00:49:11,920
and encouraged anybody who wished to

1112
00:49:18,480 --> 00:49:15,460
copy it to do so I am pleased that the

1113
00:49:21,420 --> 00:49:18,490
skeptic very magazine in your hands now

1114
00:49:23,820 --> 00:49:21,430
has also benefited from reports and

1115
00:49:26,220 --> 00:49:23,830
interviews that appear on the skeptic

1116
00:49:30,270 --> 00:49:26,230
zone but it's not just a one-way street

1117
00:49:32,310 --> 00:49:30,280
as I will in turn often read out news

1118
00:49:34,650 --> 00:49:32,320
and information that appears in this

1119
00:49:36,870 --> 00:49:34,660
journal as well as on the website of

1120
00:49:39,150 --> 00:49:36,880
Australian skeptics a good relationship

1121
00:49:41,130 --> 00:49:39,160
thank you to all who have listened over

1122
00:49:43,530 --> 00:49:41,140
the last 10 years the show has been

1123
00:49:46,140 --> 00:49:43,540
downloaded close to 4 million times and

1124
00:49:48,180 --> 00:49:46,150
found a worldwide audience it's a

1125
00:49:50,610 --> 00:49:48,190
wonderful feeling to know that people

1126
00:49:53,040 --> 00:49:50,620
have the skeptic zone in their ears as

1127
00:49:55,710 --> 00:49:53,050
they drive trucks across Canada go

1128
00:49:58,650 --> 00:49:55,720
jogging in Atlanta do the weeding in

1129
00:50:01,620 --> 00:49:58,660
Edinburgh walk the dog in Melbourne or

1130
00:50:05,490 --> 00:50:01,630
commute in Stockholm as for the future

1131
00:50:06,840 --> 00:50:05,500
of the show well no one can know can

1132
00:50:08,849 --> 00:50:06,850
they

1133
00:50:12,940 --> 00:50:08,859
[Music]

1134
00:50:14,799 --> 00:50:12,950
and that was in the zone the report

1135
00:50:16,809 --> 00:50:14,809
written by Richard Saunders that

1136
00:50:18,819 --> 00:50:16,819
appeared in the skeptic magazine the

1137
00:50:40,599 --> 00:50:18,829
journal from Australian skeptics vol 38

1138
00:50:43,479 --> 00:50:40,609
number 2 June 2018 hi this is dr. Pamela

1139
00:50:45,339 --> 00:50:43,489
gay from astronomy cast each week Fraser

1140
00:50:47,190 --> 00:50:45,349
Cain and I take our listeners on a

1141
00:50:50,349 --> 00:50:47,200
fact-based journey through the cosmos

1142
00:50:53,170 --> 00:50:50,359
with our weekly podcast we explain not

1143
00:50:54,999 --> 00:50:53,180
just what we know but how we know what

1144
00:50:57,729 --> 00:50:55,009
we know about this universe that we

1145
00:51:00,370 --> 00:50:57,739
share check us out at astronomy cast

1146
00:51:02,229 --> 00:51:00,380
calm and look for us in itunes google

1147
00:51:04,540 --> 00:51:02,239
play and where ever you download

1148
00:51:20,259 --> 00:51:04,550
podcasts see online

1149
00:51:26,539 --> 00:51:22,609
thank you for listening to the skeptic

1150
00:51:28,400 --> 00:51:26,549
zone and as I do often I think very

1151
00:51:30,559 --> 00:51:28,410
sincerely all the people who support the

1152
00:51:33,890 --> 00:51:30,569
skeptic zone financially by patreon or

1153
00:51:38,809 --> 00:51:33,900
PayPal at skeptic zone TV just click the

1154
00:51:41,900 --> 00:51:38,819
link there for subscribing and it means

1155
00:51:45,859 --> 00:51:41,910
the show goes on no people supporting

1156
00:51:48,849 --> 00:51:45,869
the show no skeptic zone and although as

1157
00:51:50,900 --> 00:51:48,859
you would have heard in this episode

1158
00:51:53,120 --> 00:51:50,910
myself and everybody else involved

1159
00:51:55,579 --> 00:51:53,130
donates most of their time for free of

1160
00:51:57,679 --> 00:51:55,589
course it's if that was the model would

1161
00:52:00,199 --> 00:51:57,689
be unsustainable there are costs I have

1162
00:52:03,469 --> 00:52:00,209
to cover including my own time so all

1163
00:52:05,839 --> 00:52:03,479
those people who do contribute you have

1164
00:52:07,099 --> 00:52:05,849
my undying thanks it really does mean a

1165
00:52:09,979 --> 00:52:07,109
lot you're not just clicking a button

1166
00:52:11,479 --> 00:52:09,989
and I hope your money go somewhere it

1167
00:52:14,870 --> 00:52:11,489
certainly does go somewhere it goes

1168
00:52:17,479 --> 00:52:14,880
right here so I can keep bringing you

1169
00:52:19,130 --> 00:52:17,489
and everybody else the skeptic zone and

1170
00:52:20,509 --> 00:52:19,140
as I've mentioned over the last few

1171
00:52:23,359 --> 00:52:20,519
weeks the Australian dollar is rather

1172
00:52:25,729 --> 00:52:23,369
poor against the American dollar at the

1173
00:52:28,579 --> 00:52:25,739
moment probably other currencies so if

1174
00:52:32,179 --> 00:52:28,589
you subscribe or you donate in American

1175
00:52:34,279 --> 00:52:32,189
dollars it gets translated to be a lot

1176
00:52:36,739 --> 00:52:34,289
more here or converted I should say in

1177
00:52:38,150 --> 00:52:36,749
Australia now I'm looking forward to

1178
00:52:39,829 --> 00:52:38,160
meeting skeptics and fans of the

1179
00:52:43,900 --> 00:52:39,839
upcoming Australian skeptics convention

1180
00:52:47,209 --> 00:52:43,910
skeptic on 2018 on the 13th and 14th of

1181
00:52:48,890 --> 00:52:47,219
October with our big trivia night on the

1182
00:52:51,439 --> 00:52:48,900
tour of October which is free by the way

1183
00:52:53,359 --> 00:52:51,449
and if you'd like to appear on the

1184
00:52:56,239 --> 00:52:53,369
skeptic zone come to the convention have

1185
00:52:57,949 --> 00:52:56,249
a look for myself on Maynard and I'm

1186
00:52:59,900 --> 00:52:57,959
sure we'll be delighted to have a quick

1187
00:53:01,939 --> 00:52:59,910
chat with you

1188
00:53:03,679 --> 00:53:01,949
we'll be looking to chat to all sorts of

1189
00:53:05,839 --> 00:53:03,689
people and I think there's gonna be a

1190
00:53:06,949 --> 00:53:05,849
dedicated media room but knowing may not

1191
00:53:10,160 --> 00:53:06,959
it's gonna be running around like a

1192
00:53:12,049 --> 00:53:10,170
goose with his microphone so don't be

1193
00:53:14,059 --> 00:53:12,059
surprised if you end up on the sceptic

1194
00:53:17,390 --> 00:53:14,069
zone there are still tickets available

1195
00:53:19,609 --> 00:53:17,400
for skeptic on and what a lineup of

1196
00:53:21,799 --> 00:53:19,619
international sceptical speakers we have

1197
00:53:25,400 --> 00:53:21,809
for you including the wonderful Pamela

1198
00:53:26,029 --> 00:53:25,410
gay Kari poppy Beth Darlington Lynne

1199
00:53:29,029 --> 00:53:26,039
Kelly

1200
00:53:31,489 --> 00:53:29,039
Yvette Don drama the list goes on and on

1201
00:53:32,130 --> 00:53:31,499
now one of the things I'll be doing at

1202
00:53:35,100 --> 00:53:32,140
the convention

1203
00:53:37,860 --> 00:53:35,110
is giving a presentation a preliminary

1204
00:53:39,720 --> 00:53:37,870
update of preliminary report on the

1205
00:53:43,460 --> 00:53:39,730
great prediction project I've been doing

1206
00:53:46,950 --> 00:53:43,470
for nearly two years gathering and

1207
00:53:49,770 --> 00:53:46,960
marking and examining hundreds of

1208
00:53:53,100 --> 00:53:49,780
predictions at the moment it's in the

1209
00:53:54,930 --> 00:53:53,110
vicinity of 1400 but with the ones I've

1210
00:53:57,570 --> 00:53:54,940
yet to catalogue it's probably going to

1211
00:53:59,310 --> 00:53:57,580
tip over 2,000 predictions I'll be

1212
00:54:01,950 --> 00:53:59,320
dealing with anyway I'll be giving you

1213
00:54:06,060 --> 00:54:01,960
an update at the convention about how

1214
00:54:08,310 --> 00:54:06,070
that's going the scores to date and how

1215
00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:08,320
particular psychics have been faring

1216
00:54:13,380 --> 00:54:10,810
over the last 17 years with their

1217
00:54:15,900 --> 00:54:13,390
mystical predictions and for the

1218
00:54:19,470 --> 00:54:15,910
technically-minded this week's episode

1219
00:54:22,050 --> 00:54:19,480
is being produced entirely on an iPad

1220
00:54:23,910 --> 00:54:22,060
using the ferret audio editor just

1221
00:54:26,340 --> 00:54:23,920
thought you'd like to know but for this

1222
00:54:33,270 --> 00:54:26,350
week this is Richard Saunders signing

1223
00:54:35,340 --> 00:54:33,280
off from Sydney Australia you've been

1224
00:54:40,800 --> 00:54:35,350
listening to the skeptic zone podcast

1225
00:54:43,830 --> 00:54:40,810
please visit our website at WWDC because

1226
00:54:46,490 --> 00:54:43,840
show notes contacts and to access the

1227
00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:46,500
bat catalog of episodes going back to

1228
00:54:53,430 --> 00:54:49,810
2008 you can follow the skeptic zone

1229
00:54:55,830 --> 00:54:53,440
podcast on twitter at skeptic zone visit

1230
00:54:59,190 --> 00:54:55,840
our facebook page or leave a review on

1231
00:55:02,580 --> 00:54:59,200
itunes you can also support the skeptic

1232
00:55:04,920 --> 00:55:02,590
zone via patreon or PayPal the skeptic

1233
00:55:06,870 --> 00:55:04,930
zone podcast is an independent

1234
00:55:09,090 --> 00:55:06,880
production reviews and opinions

1235
00:55:11,220 --> 00:55:09,100
expressed on the skeptic zone are not

1236
00:55:14,150 --> 00:55:11,230
necessarily those of Australian skeptics

1237
00:55:24,150 --> 00:55:14,160
or any other sceptical organisation

1238
00:55:29,500 --> 00:55:26,440
hello everybody who listens after the

1239
00:55:31,540 --> 00:55:29,510
music in fact what's happening there are

1240
00:55:33,820 --> 00:55:31,550
planes going buzzing around outside I

1241
00:55:35,349 --> 00:55:33,830
live near the flight path and every now

1242
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:35,359
and then I'm trying to do records and

1243
00:55:39,250 --> 00:55:37,010
voiceovers and things for the skeptic

1244
00:55:40,420 --> 00:55:39,260
zone and I have to stop very frustrating

1245
00:55:43,330 --> 00:55:40,430
so I might have who use the time

1246
00:55:45,220 --> 00:55:43,340
productively it's the old dice game and

1247
00:55:48,910 --> 00:55:45,230
those who are new to this part of the

1248
00:55:52,570 --> 00:55:48,920
show I have a ten sided die here I'm

1249
00:55:55,150 --> 00:55:52,580
gonna toss it four times this week and

1250
00:55:58,540 --> 00:55:55,160
it gives you a chance to exercise your

1251
00:55:59,859 --> 00:55:58,550
psychic powers of prediction because in

1252
00:56:02,589 --> 00:55:59,869
a strange sort of way this has already

1253
00:56:03,970 --> 00:56:02,599
happened as I speak it hasn't I don't

1254
00:56:06,880 --> 00:56:03,980
know what number is going to come up or

1255
00:56:09,070 --> 00:56:06,890
numbers neither do you but by the time

1256
00:56:11,140 --> 00:56:09,080
this is put on the internet of course

1257
00:56:14,589 --> 00:56:11,150
this recording will be in the past

1258
00:56:16,330 --> 00:56:14,599
mm-hmm anyway here we go

1259
00:56:18,310 --> 00:56:16,340
I have a ten sided I'm gonna roll at

1260
00:56:20,650 --> 00:56:18,320
four times so predict I'm gonna roll

1261
00:56:22,540 --> 00:56:20,660
this predict the first number it's gonna

1262
00:56:28,329 --> 00:56:22,550
be one two three four five six seven

1263
00:56:33,810 --> 00:56:28,339
eight nine or ten eight ain't write that

1264
00:56:41,370 --> 00:56:38,470
hmm eight how do you just trust me folks

1265
00:56:48,069 --> 00:56:41,380
here we go one more time number three

1266
00:56:51,009 --> 00:56:48,079
with the table ah off the table six

1267
00:56:58,209 --> 00:56:51,019
eight eight six five and come back and

1268
00:57:01,749 --> 00:56:58,219
the last one uh-huh three so if you got

1269
00:57:04,690 --> 00:57:01,759
eight eight six three you can apply for